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Sleeping Beauty Returns to the Vault in January

Posted December 30, 2009 10:10 AM by Josh Dreuth

Walt Disney StudiosWalt Disney Studios Home Entertainment has revealed that the 'Sleeping Beauty: 50th Anniversary Platinum Edition' Blu-ray will return to the Disney Vault on January 30th. Once it returns to the vault, no additional copies will be produced. Those who have yet to purchase the title should do so within the next month, or risk not being able to purchase a copy until its next release in 2015.

Disney systematically rotates their classic animated feature home video releases in and out of a state of moratorium in order to introduce the films to a new generation of children. Typically, home video releases, like this Blu-ray, become collector's items as availability of the titles becomes none existent, and are sold well above MSRP.

The title is expected to be re-released on Blu-ray in 2015 as a Diamond Edition, resulting in a relatively short 5-year moratorium.


Source: Blu-ray.com | Permalink | United States [Country settings]

News comments (55 comments)



Sgt Barone
  Dec 30, 2009
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dang, maybe i should jump on this, lol

TheManInBlu
  Dec 30, 2009
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I find this whole moratorium approach Disney has to their classics utterly ridiculous. Movies should always be available to the public. They've been doing this since the days of VHS and I've always hated that. What about the people that will discover Blu-ray in the years to come and will want these Disney titles? Big thumbs down Disney

rmainhammer
  Dec 30, 2009
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I would like to know the benefit if this. Seriously, does this strategy translate into more money, or is it just something to say, "Disney is special"? I already have my copy of Sleeping Beauty, by the way, but I went through this crap with the DVDs and I ended up paying up the wazoo for other titles after they had gone out of print.

halimali
  Dec 30, 2009
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Disney create the best DVDs , BDs and they pay lots of attention in making them with nice arts and slipcovers. People can always grab those classics but at a different price. I have both BD edition and the Platinum DVD. In the vault or not these guys know what they are doing.

Germtop
  Dec 30, 2009
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"...or risk not being able to purchase a copy until its next release in 2015."

The only thing you'll be risking is having to pay $50 or $60 for it on eBay. That's what happened with the DVDs.

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PowellPressburger
  Dec 30, 2009
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I think Sleeping Beauty is great to look at. Especially the widescreen scope format of this film. Also contains in HD the short feature Grand Canyon.

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obriensg1
  Dec 30, 2009
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I can buy Beauty and the Beast special edition DVD for 20 bucks at my local second hand store. BUt this Disney vault stuff has always been crap.

Speaking of Beauty and the Beast, I am VERY upset they bounced the theatrical 3D release out of the February 2010 slot! It's going to come out Christmas 2011 now. Dumb
ehtamgnie
  Dec 30, 2009
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I don't mind Disney rotating their titles through moratorium. I think it does make the release "special". All too often, a "platinum" edition (or something akin to it) turns into the de facto product which removes any distinction of adjectives used on the BD release. I'd prefer limited quantities of special editions to make them truly special. If you miss out on getting a copy of it, unfortuantely, you're out of luck.

What I DO have concerns with is that there is not a "standard" BD edition of the movie minus the benefits of supplements of the Platinum/Diamond editions. In this case, I do believe the movie should remain in the public domain, but I'm not Disney and I have no say on the matter.

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Penthouse
  Dec 30, 2009
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Strategy: Have great product, but don't sell it except for a brief period every five years. Shareholders: WTF?!

krazyclown
  Dec 30, 2009
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This is why i am buying all Disney clasics as soon as they come out im not paying out the nose later for them

wallendo
  Dec 30, 2009
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Disney does this because it works for Disney!

Catalog titles don't sell very well, especially when they are reissues; except for Disney classics, which on re-release frequently outsell new releases.

As a Disney shareholder, I am quite happy with this policy (although I am still pissed off that Song of the South never leaves the vault. It's not that great a movie, but, it still irks me)

ShellOilJunior
  Dec 30, 2009
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I might get this with a price drop.

According to AVS forum the disc is reference quality.

RIKANA
  Dec 30, 2009
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I've got the steelbook, and well, I like the film, so i'll be getting it again on Blu-ray 2015.


RI
Antirock
  Dec 30, 2009
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This policy is actually a brilliant idea. I am not really interested in owning Sleeping Beauty on blu-ray. But since I knew that my window for getting it was small, I went ahead and bought it when it came out.

I am sure a lot of people do this. If something is always available, then people are less likely to buy it. When you create an urgency to buy something, people will scurry to get it before they can't anymore.

KidOmega123
  Dec 30, 2009
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Well, that was quick. It feels like this title was just released. Although they've subsequently released other Disney classics as well. So, I guess it's about time. Oh well, got mine on day one.

Speaking from a Disney collectors standpoint, I gotta agree with the notion that the moratorium makes the titles more sought after, or "special". It's basic SUPPLY & DEMAND theory. Limit the supply and the demand will go up. What other studio can brag that their catalog titles are breaking sales records 40-50 years after their initial release? As annoying as it is to consumers like us, who want that instant gratification of getting whatever titles we want; whenever we want. As a business construct for them, it's actually quite brilliant. The way they've been able to control their properties to ensure they continue to make money off of movies we've all seen a million different times, is obviously working for them.

SO...if you didn't get your copy. Do so. It's more than worth it. Otherwise you will be waiting 5 years of paying 80 bux for it on eBay.

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MikeDaWiz
  Dec 30, 2009
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2015?!?! You mean in the Future?!!!? HEHE
moviemadness
  Dec 30, 2009
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I think I am going to skip this one...I am really not that interested in seeing it or owning it.
Titanicfave
  Dec 30, 2009
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I jumped on that back in October 2008~better jump on this if you don't have it because they'll be no year 2015~the world ends in 2012!

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Lucy Diamond
  Dec 30, 2009
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This vault thing was should have been done away with in the dawning of ebay.

You can find whatever you want, whether Disney wants you to have it or not if you are willing to pay for it.

I get it...they want to keep the classics classic. It's just harder to do that now.

hostelmovies
  Dec 30, 2009
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I think what everyone is missing here is: at least they tell us about it now. I remember years ago when they did not announce it and it would take you weeks to track down the title.

BTobin
  Dec 30, 2009
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I personally find the disney vault to be completely hilarious, I laugh so hard every time I see one of those commercials, It must be the incredibly cheerful voice in the backround and the whole notion of it, but it's just so ridiculous. Besides they'll re-release it in some sort of triple deluxe 5 disc diamond platinum edition in another year or so.

there is a funny snl cartoon about this but I couldn't find it, but this one is a funny take on it also
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ee6iaK5gA4

thdeanmachine
  Dec 30, 2009
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everyone knows Disney does this. No sense in complaining. If you want the title then buy it while its out. Disney also lets you know its going into the vault so it isnt a surprise when it is no longer on the shelves. I like the idea of the vault. It creates a demand and a reason for Disney to remaster their films and make them look even better for the next release.

Jason1978
  Dec 30, 2009
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Disney might put out some of the best dvds/blu rays but their prices are too much. DVD versions of all of their movies are $20 and never drop.

Disney needs to lower the damn price. Sleeping Beauty is currently $30 and has been since the week after it came out. Even Snow White is currently $19.99 and UP is $17.99. Sleeping Beauty is the most expensive Disney blu ray at the moment.

Melesine
  Dec 30, 2009
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wow, perfect timing for me I just bought my copy. Watched it last night and it looked incredible.

TheManInBlu
  Dec 30, 2009
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To BTobin: Thanks for that YouTube link; that was hilarious! Still laughing about it. Big meow meows and super princes. Brilliant. Check it out everyone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ee6iaK5gA4

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Crimson King
  Dec 30, 2009
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I already got mine a long time ago!

thunderforce
  Dec 30, 2009
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I hope the dont start to do this to marvel movies to.
samir72
  Dec 30, 2009
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Who Cares !!
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mywhitenoise
  Dec 30, 2009
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Do they really make that much money on ebay? It's hard to imagine anyone paying over $35 for a blu-ray on ebay.

Should I pick up the remaining 3 steelbooks at my Best Buy?

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DrrnHarr
  Dec 30, 2009
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I have no problem with Disney taking the moratorium approach to titles. They always give advance warning of the moratorium to allow us to pick up the title beforehand.

The supply and demand theaory is valid and if you don't believe me check out the crazy prices for David Lean's "Doctor Zhivago" on DVD, even though it is a commonly known fact that the movie is being released on Blu-ray in 2010.

ClarkGriswold
  Dec 30, 2009
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The idea of putting them away, I agree makes it more sought after. Makes it more special to have it.

And look at it like this. A kid is 10 or 12 and watches one of the films, grows up with it since they were like 5 or 6. Come the time they are 18 or again at 24 etc. They are starting families by 24 or 29 etc. Perfect time to re-release and they buy them for thier new budding families.

I have collected for years, but even more now having a 3 yr old and a 2 yr old myself.

andyman1970
  Dec 30, 2009
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I really think Warner should try this approach with Lord of the Rings then Lucas could do it with Star Wars and Indiana Jones. They should come out and say there are only going to be X amount of these disc published and when they're gone they're gone.
ThatArtGuy
  Dec 30, 2009
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The problem with Lucas is when he says you'll never get them again, you won't. Ever.
TTC1984
  Dec 30, 2009
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Consdiering they're going to be reissuing in that Diamond Edition format (probably with more bonus material) anyway, I'll hold off and buy it then.

If I want to watch the existing version, I'll just rent it.

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Trogdor2010
  Dec 30, 2009
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I'm not sure if it's the best idea, not exactly for disney's profitability for it's reissues, but for long term adoption of the Blu ray format for disney that later owners that are interested in the movie's remaster. Good for early adopters to have purchased it now, but the cold shoulder for the remainder that are new to the format until of course, 2015.

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Dynamo of Eternia
  Dec 30, 2009
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Titanicfave: "I jumped on that back in October 2008~better jump on this if you don't have it because they'll be no year 2015~the world ends in 2012!"

Oh, there's going to be a 2015! And the Cubs are going to win the World Series, dang it!!!



In all seriousness, I understand why Disney does the whole vault thing. It helps keep up a perception of high value and quality in their movies and releases. If Disney didn't have the vault system and had all of their movies out indefinately, many would eventually become fodder for the $5 bin at Wal-Mart. And while I'm sure some people wouldn't mind getting Disney movies at that price, it doesn't help maintain a certain perception.

So, from a business standpoint it makes sense. And the timing between a movie getting released and then getting released again doesn't seem like it is as long these days as it used to be. And there is constantly something come out of the vault, so even if people come to Blu-Ray for the first time a few months or a year from now and miss out on the first couple of Disney Blu-Ray releases, plenty of other stuff will be out for them to get, and eventually the movies that they missed out on will find their way back to another release.

Turnda643
  Dec 30, 2009
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Keep in mind. Disney doesnt put every title in the 'Vault.' Only their Platinum titles. AKA the "classics."
Sammy
  Dec 30, 2009
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This is all about Congress' failure to deal with copyright laws that are controlled by those with the money made from the copyright. The constitution states that there shall be a copyright for "a limited time" created by Congress and Congress keeps extending that "time" mainly due to lobbying by Disney (and other studios) to protect their mouse and other characters.

Quote from the U.S. Constitution, Article 1, Section 8 ("Powers of Congress"): "To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries".

That said, I'll probably pick it up in the next couple of weeks.

Frode
  Dec 30, 2009
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While I'm not a big fan of perpetual copyright either, in this case it actually ensures that whoever releases a title has a potential income to justify spending the money to restore it properly. If anyone could release it, there would hardly be a market for premium editions like this - either that, or the discs would cost $100, not $36, and the shops would be flooded with cheap copies of VHS masters.
Sammy
  Dec 30, 2009
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DrrnHarr 5 hours ago

I have no problem with Disney taking the moratorium approach to titles. They always give advance warning of the moratorium to allow us to pick up the title beforehand.

The supply and demand theaory is valid and if you don't believe me check out the crazy prices for David Lean's "Doctor Zhivago" on DVD, even though it is a commonly known fact that the movie is being released on Blu-ray in 2010.


I have that DVD and have considered selling it knowing that it is a for sure double-dipper for me. The value of the DVD may actually go down sometime around May.

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Rhylliam
  Dec 30, 2009
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This is one of THE best Blu-rays in my collection. BUY IT!!

I_Luv_The_Blu'z
  Dec 30, 2009
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I never took the 'Disney Vault' seriously. Go on E-Bay and you'll be surprised how many copies of a movie are still flying around. Six years from now I'll still be able to find this version of Sleeping Beauty on Blu-Ray.

nazdar
  Dec 30, 2009
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Sleeping Beauty is IT. And Disney has been doing this since before they existed
travis8214
  Dec 31, 2009
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The reason Disney has the vault here is almost purely marketing. Disney purists will buy every single version of every classic. Really. It's actually bordering on ingenious but in an "evil scientist" kind of way. Just the different artwork is enough for said purists, and the fact that they typically add another disk and/or a myriad of special features is another selling point.

Not for me, no, and I love Disney (well not their LOL TALKING ANIMALS movies), but for some. I know someone who bought Pinocchio (DVD) on the spot, spur of the moment kind of thing, and they already had the previous DVD. Keep in mind this was also at Barnes & Noble - possibly some of the worst disc media prices ever.
travis8214
  Dec 31, 2009
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Anyway, forgot to add. This truly is a must have. I also have the Pinocchio Blu-Ray, and often tempted to get Snow White, but this is the best of the three as far as remastering goes. They cleaned up the cells a bit and added depth of field to Pinocchio, too, sure, but they did an even more amazing job with Sleeping Beauty, in my opinion.

mrbaltan
  Dec 31, 2009
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I got Sleeping Beauty with Up in a combo deal on Amazon.com all for $30. And while Up is incredible, SB has been played in my house more than any other BD. The PQ is jaw dropping and it is the disc i show when people ask me "whats the difference between BD and DVD?"
cdoosc21
  Dec 31, 2009
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I understand how Disney can keep the value perception up with the Vault strategy, but certain decisions on their films mystify me.

For instance, how can it be that in 2010 we will have had no release of Hercules since 2000? And no anamorphic release ever? Rescuers Down Under, same situation.

With these two films, they missed out completely on an opportunity to sell an anamorphic DVD to the Blu-ray early adopters. Now they will probably remain "in the vault" until a Blu-ray release.
taylorw
  Jan 01, 2010
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Better buy it now or wait until 2015! What a bunch of crap. Disney has so many amazing classics but this kind of shit makes me respect the company very little. It's these kinds of marketing schemes that allow me to understand people who download movies illegally.
Twile
  Jan 02, 2010
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I know I'm going to be flamed for this, but I'll say it anyway... It's stuff like this which makes me feel zero guilt about the idea of renting and ripping. It's illegal, you say? A violating of terms of use? Not paying enough for the right to watch a movie over and over again? (as if anyone watches a movie they own more than twice on average).

You know what else is illegal? An abusive monopoly. That's exactly what movie companies, such as Disney here, have. They're the only ones who can authorize the circulation of more copies of their movies. And they do it in a way which is restrictive and frustrating to their (would be) customers. To what end? So they have an excuse to air an advertisement every decade and get a regular boost of sales. This isn't the pre-VHS era where a theatrical re-release required paid advertisements and manufacture/distribution of film to theaters, so it was only done every so often. We're on the third generation of home movie media, we've had internet auction and rental services for years, and video-on-demand is even becoming commonplace. The only excuse for this antiquated strategy of releasing the movies from the Disney Vault is to try and squeeze consumers for extra money by upping demand and limiting supply.

Sorry, Disney. Your films easily pull a profit from their initial releases, and have brought in a lot, lot more from more than half a century of re-releasing to theaters and the home market. You've made your money a hundred times over. When you want more money from me, you can make new stuff. What's that, Disney? You spend money on each restoration, trying to make it the best-ever version? Awesome. The sales you get from the first release will surely pay for that. You'll get a sale from me, too, when you stop this vault nonsense.

On that note, does anyone know offhand how large the AVC video stream plus a FLAC encode of the 7.1 Master Audio and the AC3 audio commentary for Sleeping Beauty is?

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Dynamo of Eternia
  Jan 02, 2010
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Sammy: "This is all about Congress' failure to deal with copyright laws that are controlled by those with the money made from the copyright. The constitution states that there shall be a copyright for "a limited time" created by Congress and Congress keeps extending that "time" mainly due to lobbying by Disney (and other studios) to protect their mouse and other characters.

Quote from the U.S. Constitution, Article 1, Section 8 ("Powers of Congress"): "To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries".

That said, I'll probably pick it up in the next couple of weeks. "



Honestly, I am glad that these copyrights keep getting renewed/extended. Do you know what would happen if these copyrights fell through? This isn't just about distributing existing movies. The rights to the characters, themselves, would be up for anyone to use to make and sell their own original content, etc. That means they can put these characters in any scenario, make 'adult' content using Mickey, Minnie, etc (I know some stuff like this exists now on the internet to some degree on an unofficial level), but the lack of copyrights would just open the flood gates for this sort of thing. And it wouldn't just be as simple as kid-friendly content and adult content. There would likely be a whole gray area in the middle. Determining what movies/DVDs/Blu-Rays are appropriate for your kid could become quite the chore.

While Disney could still put out their own editions of these movies and original content with their existing characters in this scenario, odds are it would get buried amongst the other editions, etc. There would be almost nothing stopping people from opening their own "Disney" Theme Parks using those characters with the expired copyrights. And as such, attendance at the existing theme parks would likely suffer. All hell would break loose.

My wife and I happen to enjoy going to Walt Disney World in Florida, so I can say that I don't want to see this happen.

This wouldn't just effect Disney either, many classic characters like Superman, Looney Tunes characters, etc. would have fallen victim to this (or would soon) if the rights weren't extended.


In my opinion, having the copyrights expire and not be extended for a property that has been lying dormant for many, many years is one thing. But when the property is still in regular, active use by the creator (or the company that the creator built or sold the rights off to) as a source of revenue, like the Disney characters, movies, theme parks, etc, are, then the rights shouldn't expire. I don't see any reason for this to change. I hope that the rights never expire for them.





Twile: "I know I'm going to be flamed for this, but I'll say it anyway... It's stuff like this which makes me feel zero guilt about the idea of renting and ripping. It's illegal, you say? A violating of terms of use? Not paying enough for the right to watch a movie over and over again? (as if anyone watches a movie they own more than twice on average).

You know what else is illegal? An abusive monopoly. That's exactly what movie companies, such as Disney here, have. They're the only ones who can authorize the circulation of more copies of their movies. And they do it in a way which is restrictive and frustrating to their (would be) customers. To what end?"



I don't see how that's an abusive Monopoly.

As big as Disney is, they are not a Monopoly. A Monopoly would be more like there only being one movie studio at all, and determines the rules and regulations of every aspect of movie releases, and they were forcing us to pay something like $60+ per movie (actual price, not MSRP) to own any movie.

If Disney were to not use the 'vault' system, many of their movies would sooner or later become fodder for the $5 Wal-Mart bin. Now, I know that you probably don't mind the idea of only paying $5 for a Disney movie (and I honestly wouldn't mind that price either, if it were realistic), but you have to look at what it would really mean.

Let's face it, many movies have come out on DVD over the years that had one release come out, get cheap, then have another 'special edition' or whatever come out after it, but with the older, lesser, cheaper edition not going out of print (or at least still sitting on the shelves if it has been discontinued) next to the new edition. The result is very likely fewer sales of the newer edition. Average people, who aren't as picky about picture quality and/or don't do research, may just see the 2 editions sitting on the shelf side by side, see that one is much cheaper, and choose that one. And not as many copies of the newer version sell.

Disney avoids this by having the vault system. And I can't blame them for it. They have an overall brand to maintain. And (while Disney has had it's lesser products, like some of the crappy straight to video sequels to classic movies that have been made) overall the Disney brand is one of quality.

And it's not like the prices on Disney movies are that terrible. There have been some really good Blu-Ray deals lately (just look at the people who got Up and Monsters Inc on BD for really cheap... in some cases for a total of 97 cents).

There are sales and deals to be had, many of which don't require coupons (and even the standard day to day prices on Amazon are rather reasonable). The price of Sleeping Beauty, and most other Disney movies, on BD is not unreasonable, and it is in NO way a reasonable measure by which to justify piracy. Basically, you are justifying pirating a rental copy because you cannot go out and buy the movie to own for around the price of renting a movie or paying for an on demand viewing. Well boo-hoo, cry me a river.

The problem here seems to be that everyone wants everything for free (or just shy of it), and exactly there way (i.e. wanting copyrights to expire). That's just absolutely ridiculous. The companies that created and/or now own the rights to these movies have every right to make money off of them. In the case of Disney, there is nothing wrong with their vault sytem, it's been in place for sometime now, everyone should have known this would happen with the Blu-Rays as well, and if you didn't, well here's your warning. It's still out there. You can still get it. If you want it, buy it. If you don't want it or if it's not worth it to you, the don't. But either way, stop complaining.... because there's really nothing reasonable to complain about.

If you feel differently, then maybe buying and collecting movies in any format isn't a good hobby for you.
Twile
  Jan 02, 2010
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Dynamo: Of course Disney has a monopoly. Sure, it's not on all movies, but it is on some movies. Their own movies. Let's face it, one movie isn't a perfect substitute for the rest. Shrek isn't a substitute for The Lion King, Lord of the Rings isn't a substitute for Star Wars, etc. Each movie has its own story and personality, strengths and weaknesses. That's something we live with and generally don't complain about, until companies are very plainly not doing things in the best interests of consumers. Comparison: if there was a single company providing flights within the continental US, would you not say they had a monopoly? Sure you can still use ground transportation, but that's not a very good substitute for flights in most cases. I promise you that were that to happen and the company said "We're only offering flights during these months, to make the experience of flight seem more valuable and so people will pay more", a lot of people would be up in arms and cry 'abusive monopoly'. I don't see how this is terribly different.

No disrepsect to Disney, but those titles deserve to be in the $5 bin by this point. They've been milking them for millions since release. They've been grossly profitable, and they've made their barrels of money, and they should drop their prices accordingly. They have next to no expenses for stamping a new DVD, they should cover those expenses, take a bit of profit for their time, and call it a day.

Your justification for the vault system is completely flawed. Per the very existence of the vault, it's obvious that Disney is able to stop producing and thus limit the distribution of any disc they want. So why not stop stamping the older editions of a movie and only make the newer ones? Sure, in any given store there might be the cheaper edition and the newer, more expensive, special edition, and Joe Consumer might pick up the cheaper one because he just doesn't care. Then there's one fewer of those in that store, and there are only a finite number. Given enough time and they'll all be sold, and then people won't have any choice but to get the newer edition. They can still put out new editions as they desire. I might argue that their ability to keep making Classic Special Diamond Carbon Fiber editions and force people to buy them if they want the movie, period, is monopolistic and that people shouldn't be coerced by artificial supply limitations to subsidize the creation of new special features, but that's a side point. Although who knows, if they were limited to just one "complete" edition of each movie, they might work really really hard on putting everything into that collection that they possibly can, and we might have stronger products from that limitation. In any case, there's no reason that your 'doomsday' scenario of new editions not selling because the old ones are still on shelves would have to pan out that way. Disney just has to say "We're not making the Gold Edition discs any longer. We're making Platinum." or whatever else they wish to call the editions. Problem solved.

I'm sorry if you have moral objections to the idea of someone not providing additional money to a monopolistic business, but that's not really my problem. I paid to see The Lion King in theaters. I paid for it on VHS. I paid for it on DVD. And I'm willing to pay, like a sucker, for it on Blu-ray. But Disney won't give it to me. It's not that they have to do any fancy restoration or remixing work, they've already got it in surround sound and it was rendered from a digital system. They just don't want it on the market right now. And although I can go out and buy Sleeping Beauty or other in-print movies today, what of the people who haven't yet adopted Blu-ray? Do you expect them to stock up on movies that they can't even watch yet so that, when they come around to the world of high-def, they'll have their Disney fix? If you aren't able to see how this constitutes a consumer-unfriendly environment, well then, there's really nothing I can do or say to make you see the light.

Realistically I'm only going to watch a movie once or twice. Renting is probably the best "ownership" option for me, because I don't need unlimited viewing for any movie, but I'm not aware of any service that provides Blu-ray quality on demand, without waiting a couple days for the movie to come in the mail. That's just unacceptable when I have someone visiting and we're picking out a movie to watch, or I have a sudden urge to watch a scene from an old favorite. I've already paid to see, on DVD or in theaters, all the movies in my collection, and I think it's unreasonable to pay full price, yet again, just to see the movie in high def a few more times. They aren't going to have my business with their current prices and practices, whether or not I enjoy their films in high-def through ripping a rental really doesn't impact their quarterly earnings.

No, it's a great hobby for me. I love movies.
rlj1010
  Jan 03, 2010
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The thing with the Disney vault is.... every time they re-issue a title, they supposedly remaster everything, and it's a notable quality improvement over previous releases.

With the Sleeping Beauty Blu-Ray, haven't we already reached the pinnacle of what a transfer can look like? How much better can they really get it to look in five years? I don't know. I think we may have reached the limit.

BTobin
  Jan 03, 2010
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ok this is the best disney vault related spoof of all time

http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/clips/disney-vault-vt/27139/

Top contributor
Dynamo of Eternia
  Jan 04, 2010
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Twile:

Your arguement is all over the place and doesn't really make any kind of coherent sense, with all due respect.

First of all, to say that Disney has a "monopoloy" over their own movies is rather ridiculous. Technically by that standard, all studios have a "monopoly" over their own movies. Just because one studio chooses to keep many of it's movies available indefinately does not make it any less a 'monopoloy' than what Disney has, based on the standards that you are using.

Your comparison to airline flights is flawed as well. Sure, you can choose from different airlines to get to the same destination, but that doesn't mean you are getting the same end "product". Part of the difference is the cost, what ammenidites are offered with the flight, etc. So, no two airlines will necessarily offer the same, identical service (simiar to how Shrek and the Lion King aren't the same thing).

Also, in the case of airlines, while their may not be a moratoreum (i.e. only being able to fly to certain destinations at certain times of year) on flights, the people who book earlier do tend to pay less than the people who book at the last minute. So, there is a "moratoreum" as to when you can get your flight at the best prices. I'm sure you'll argue it's not the same thing, but the movies business and airline business are two VERY different type of businesses, so it's not the best comparison to begin with.

Addtionally, you seem to be arguing two different things and lumping them into one. You are upset about the "vault" process, and you are upset that you can't get some movies like The Lion King on Blu-Ray right now. But even if the "vault" process didn't exist, there is no guarantee that it would mean that all of Disney's movies (even just the ones that don't necessarily need a ton of restoration done to them) would be available right now.

If the vault process never existed, all that would mean is that most any movie that Disney ever released on DVD would still be available on DVD. It would not suddenly mean that Blu-Ray editions of every movie would be available right away.

Heck, look at the other movies that you mentioned in your last post.... Shrek, Star Wars, and Lord of the Rings. With the sole exception the the 3rd Shrek movie, none of the movies from any of those series are available on Blu-Ray right now, despite still being available on DVD for some time.

And of all of those that aren't on Blu-Ray, the only ones that have been announced is the Lord of the Rings Trilogy, and even that is only the theatrical versions and not the extended versions that many people prefer. Regardless of whether or not they've gone out of print on DVD, shouldn't you be just as upset about them not being on Blu-Ray RIGHT NOW like you are with Disney movies like The Lion King?

The point is that even if Disney didn't regularly take their movies out of print, that doesn't mean that all of those movies would be available on Blu-Ray right now, at this very moment.

And let's face it, you said yourself that you saw the Lion King in theaters and bought it on VHS and DVD, and will again on Blu-Ray. Odds are, with you being the movie collector that you are, you will probably buy it on Blu-Ray not long after it first comes out (long before it could ever potentially become discount fodder if Disney were to eliminate the vault system). And once you've bought it, you will have it. It is there, and as long as you don't get is scratched or anything and take care of it, it will work for years and years to come, through any subsequent re-releases that the film may have on Blu-Ray or any other format.

So, as such, given what seems to be your style of collecting movies, the vault system is rather a moot point. Even if Disney didn't discontinue their movies like they currently do, they wouldn't release all of them on Blu-Ray in one shot (or within a very short time span). They would spread them out anyway, much like they are doing now.

And really, there are good deals to be had with them. Up and Monsters Inc had some incredible great deals. With coupons and coupon codes, many people got Snow White on Blu-Ray for around $10. There great deals to be had with upgrading, so I fail to see the overall problem.

Yeah, the vault system kind of sucks for those joining Blu-Ray late in the game. But Disney is also trying to push people in getting the Blu-Ray versions now by including the DVD version with it, so that they don't have to upgrade again later anyway (going to the extent of releasing the Snow White Blu-Ray/DVD combo set in both Blu-Ray and DVD packaging), so they are doing what they can to make the transition as easy as possible for those who haven't quite made the jump over to Blu-Ray yet. Disney has also been rather pivotal in the promotion of the Blu-Ray format, so overall I can't take much issue with what they've been doing.
Twile
  Jan 15, 2010
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Dynamo: You miss my point with the airline comparison. But it's not worth explaining again.

Yes. Every studio does have monopolistic control over their movies. So do software companies, and game companies. I don't complain about that until they're abusing that control.

I am upset about Lord of the Rings. It's one of my prime examples of how this stuff is all kinds of messed up. The last one came out in 2003. In theaters, these films had a profit on the order of billions of dollars. They released them on DVD (twice) and then didn't touch them for years. I'd think they would be natural candidates for early high-def release given their massive appeal and the great attention to detail that was put into them. A roughly comparably successful trilogy which finished around the same time, The Matrix, came out on HD DVD in 2007 and Blu-ray in 2008. Why not LotR? You could maybe argue that that New Line Cinema didn't want to risk fouling up the launch of such a great series until the high def war was over, but it's been nearly 2 years since that happened. Films from that era shouldn't require extensive remastering and they probably have completely digital versions sitting around. I don't see why they had to wait two years after the final crushing defeat of HD DVD to encode their copies into AVC or VC-1. In a sense, it doesn't really matter. I'm positive that if any company could distribute copies of Lord of the Rings as long as they paid royalties, we would've seen the movies in homes in 1080p a good 4+ years ago. And we wouldn't have to wait an unspecified length of time to get Extended Editions either.

Same stuff from Disney. For older films which require extensive restoration I won't argue with their approach, but for newer films which already exist in digital mediums, the only excuse for them not already being out is to try and work more sales at higher prices.

If it seems that I'm lumping a few things together, then that's because I am. I'm generally fed up, as my post originally said, with studios being anti-consumer. The Vault is just one part of that from just one company. If there was no Vault, would there automagically be Blu-ray copies of all the newer Disney movies? No. That would require Disney to have pleasing customers as a higher priority than making the highest profit per (already profitable) film. See my prior point, if any company were allowed access to digital archival copies of Disney movies and allowed to redistribute them so long as they paid a certain minimum royalty per copy, some company would've certainly jumped to release each movie on Blu-ray by now. I give studios a bit of leeway in my expectations. I don't expect that every past film they did should be out on Blu-ray now. I just think it's all kinds of messed up that Disney announces their releases up through 2015, 9 years after Blu-ray stuff was first out... and those releases are still missing more recent 2D animated films. They're working the market, and monopolies are only supposed to be able to do that so much.

I hope you understand my point and my gripe right now. Just getting rid of the Vault system wouldn't instantly make all the movies appear on shelves, no. And it doesn't cause movies like Lord of the Rings to appear either. Their absence is, however, explained by the same motivation as the vault. They're controlling supply and demand on goods with no marginal cost. How you don't find it objectionable that companies are creating artificial supply limitations on goods only they can produce is beyond me.

As far as I'm concerned, as soon as you create something for the sake of selling it, and you're given exclusive rights (copyright, patent, whatever IP rights are applicable) to it, you have an obligation to make sure it's available to people who want it. If you don't want to oversee its distribution yourself, then let other companies do that. Don't make a movie, release it in theaters, put out a limited number of DVDs and then sue people for downloading copies of the movie when they're unable to purchase them in standard stores for standard prices. Don't make that movie and have a high-def digital copy on your company servers, show it on TV in high-def (I'm looking at you, Lord of the Rings), and then twiddle your thumbs for half a decade while millions of fans are digging for every scrap of information about when, if ever, they can pay for pristine high-def copies to enjoy at home. If your failed summer blockbuster film from 1962 and its degraded master copy will not sell enough Blu-ray copies to pay for the remastering cost, I'm not going to chew you out... if your 3-billion-dollar-grossing hobbit adventure trilogy or massively popular singing lion animated film aren't available on Blu-ray though, I just can't write that off as anything less than milking consumers.


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